I haven't actlly seen Sucker Punch, but I think this comparison is kind of shallow and ignores the complexities of the show, mainly the serious consequence of all these horrible things happening resulted in the world ending.

PLUS, people aren't dumb and can distinguish between different things; it seems like Dollhouse and Sucker Punch are trying to do two different things (at least from what I just read from Wikipedia).

See, yesterday, all I can think of is that, "HDU! Joss > Zack Snyder", which isn't a very good argument. But yes, Suckerpunch (judging from the trailers and the reviews + wikipedia) pales in comparison to Dollhouse when it comes to the consequences.

I am afraid to start discussion on Tumblr; I find most people there too aggressive.

I actually just watched Sucker Punch two days ago and so I find this very interesting.

And wrong.

First Sucker Punch so overtly sexualizes the act of rape, and it is almost entirely about rape. In Dollhouse rape isn't as sexualized, no doubt partially because of the venue of being on network television. But also because the dolls were raped through manipulation and through the revoking of their consent which changes the visual sexual connotations of the situation. And we are visual creatures. The one rapist who is in no gray zone, and with whom the rape is truly physical is with Sierra's first handler (the one who Dominic ends up hitting and then DeWitt smiles) is punished, quite wholly, and ironically and by women, that is the closest comparison with Sucker Punch and I think Dollhouse handles it better.

Second Whedon has stated (and I have to say it wasn't the best execution Joss has ever done, I do think they should've done fewer "romantic engagements" and had it more like s2 in s1) and it was shown in the show (most specifically the end of s2 and Echoes) that everything is gray and we are all part of the problem. And maybe this makes me a bad feminist, but I do find the consent issues gray. One of the biggest points of the show ended up being that: THE MANUFACTURED PERSONALITIES HAD SOME VALIDITY. This is why we have Alpha. Caroline has to deal with each of her personalities and ends up differently than Alpha (still not being entirely Echo) but she isn't Caroline anymore either. That that happened may be bad, but it doesn't reverse the choices of those personalities. I've also written papers on how the appearance of things becomes the thing itself (most specifically power, my favorite paper I ever wrote) and the dolls give the appearance of consent. In Sucker Punch there is no appearance of consent there is no question of morality; there is no reason for the rape-heavy plot.

Also, as for "Paul Ballard is a terrible person. He gets the girl." ... ... ... ... HE ENDED UP INSIDE THE GIRL'S HEAD, BEING ONE OF THOSE KIND OF VALID PERSONALITIES WITHOUT A BODY! HOW IS THAT GETTING THE GIRL! HOW! IT IS IN FACT REALLY CREPPY AND YET THE MILLIONTH REASON WHY PAUL/CAROLINE IS WEIRD.

My greatest anti-feminist vibe from Dollhouse comes from Bennet's death.

Edited 2011-06-28 11:07 pm (UTC)

I haven't watched the movie, so I can't comment on it fully.

I do agree about the consent issues on Dollhouse being on the gray side-- some of the Actives were volunteers. Did they know the extent of what would happen to them when they've signed away their body for five years? Not really. But they had an idea of what might happen to them yet they still chose to sign up.

Yep, totally with you on Paul/Caroline. It was creepy and sad. Sad because Echo truly regretted that she never let him in (in a yay, Paul gets the girl! weird vibes). Creepy because that was how she coped with it.

I suck with these kinds of fandom discussion things. :|